Who is Stan Kroenke Anyway?

By: Homey | September 3rd, 2011

Stan-Kroenke-001
I’m not really sure I have a firm answer to that question, and this blog will be based on a lot of speculation on my part. To be honest, I don’t know what exactly happens behind the scenes, in terms of who’s controlling the purse strings and making major decisions about financial issues. But what’s interesting to me is the fact that when people complain about what’s going on at Arsenal (especially during the transfer window), almost all of the comments pertain to either the board or to Wenger. Hardly anyone ever mentions the guy who actually owns a majority share of the club. And since he’s nicknamed “Silent Stan,” it’s hard to dig very deep and find about more about his role in what’s going on. But for me, if we want to talk about who’s ultimately responsible for the business side of the club, we have to talk about Kroenke first and foremost. So I’ll do my best to sort out what we can learn about him.

Relying heavily on his Wiki page, we know that he was born in Columbia, Missouri, USA, and he resides there today. His money comes from both his personal real estate dealings, and the fact that he married Ann Walton, daughter of the founder of Wal-Mart. Forbes estimates his worth at $2.6 billion, which is quite a lot of money, but nowhere close to what some of the mega-rich Premier League owners have. Also according to Forbes, Arsenal is worth $1.2 billion, so if Kroenke ever bought up 100% ownership, then nearly half his net worth would be invested in Arsenal.

But of course Arsenal is not his only sports investment – far from it. He also owns the NBA Denver Nuggets, MLS Colorado Rapids, NHL Colorado Avalanche, National Lacrosse League Colorado Mammoth, and NFL St. Louis Rams. It’s the Rams who are by far the most valuable of all of these American clubs – valued at $929 million in 2008. When you consider that the Nuggets are valued at about $321 million, you begin to see that nearly all of Kroenke’s net worth seems to be tied up in his many sports franchises. So I think it’s safe to say that he doesn’t have a few hundred million dollars lying around, waiting to be spent on a soccer superstar. Furthermore, I don’t really have any evidence that he yearns for success at Arsenal more than his other clubs in the United States.

While we’re on the topic of Kroenke’s other sports teams, there’s the obvious question of how well they’re all doing. I would say that overall, they’re in the middle of the road. His hockey team was among the best in the league a decade ago when he bought the team. Since those glory years, the team has generally declined. The American football team is also in the middle of the road, or just below it. However, he only recently purchased a majority share there. His American soccer team won the last MLS title, but besides that, they haven’t been a consistent force. And his basketball team has been a little above average for the last several years.

Before we draw too many conclusions from all of that, I’ll say a word in his defense. His teams are either in St. Louis or Denver, which are medium-sized cities with medium revenues. I won’t bore you all with the complexities of salary caps and revenue sharing in various different American professional sports, and I would rather not research that either. But overall, I think it’s fair to say that none of his American teams are real giants in terms of what they should be expected to do. If we had to make a comparison, it would maybe be as if he owned Aston Villa or Everton.

Let’s now turn our attentions back to what he’s doing at Arsenal, and how he plans to operate the club. It’s pretty obvious already that he’s not the sugar-daddy type owner – the type that Usmanov might be. And I think the evidence shows that he couldn’t be that type of owner even if he wanted to be, because he simply doesn’t have that type of wealth. Or at least not enough liquid wealth to pump into player investment.

The next question is how much involvement he has in day-to-day operations. Obviously, with living in the U.S. and running other sports teams, he’s not ever going to be a real hands-on owner. But how much he’s going to leave to Wenger and the board, and how much he’s going to take upon himself is still pretty much a complete unknown to me. During the transfer window, about the only real story we got on Kroenke was when he reportedly flew in to London to insist that Wenger sell Nasri, rather than risk losing him for nothing next summer. Assuming this story is true, it’s both encouraging and frustrating. Most of us were hoping that if Nasri didn’t sign a new contract, we should get what we could for him this summer. And there was growing fear that Wenger would hold on to him and lose him for nothing anyway. So if that story is true, it’s definitely a good sign of fiscal responsibility. But at the same time, I find it frustrating that we didn’t hear stories of Kroenke flying in to insist that Wenger invest heavily in a superstar player or two.

At this point, I’m still desperately trying to figure out exactly what the board does anymore. In the old days, when there was no majority owner, I can certainly see the centrality of the board in making major decisions. But now, Kroenke can essentially do what he pleases. A while back, I asked Tim Payton just what the board does, and here was his answer:

Now that Stan Kroenke has majority ownership (more than 50%) of Arsenal, he has complete operational control over issues such as hiring the executive team and day to day financial decisions. He also appoints the Board, and as part of his takeover statement he promised to retain the existing Board for at least one year. Some major company decisions require more than 75% of the shareholders to vote in favour of them at an Extraordinary General Meeting (EGM). These decisions might include paying a management fee, changing the name of the club or issuing new equity.

My guess is that while Kroenke can still control just about everything going on at Arsenal, he defers to the board and to Wenger for most decisions. This is likely due to the fact that he’s much newer to all things Arsenal than the board members, and the fact that he’s busy with other things in the U.S. Still, when people say things like, “Wenger is unable to give out the kind of player contracts that he wants, because the board doesn’t let him,” I think they’re looking in the wrong place. I don’t completely agree with this theory in the first place, but if indeed Wenger is operating under extreme financial restrictions, I think we need to look no further than Kroenke on that issue. Surely he’s the one who sets broad policy guidelines on major budgetary issues, and then the board and Wenger operate under those guidelines.

The next question we have to ask about Kroenke should be fairly simple to answer. And that is, which one of two general categories of sports owners does he fall under? One category is the one that treats the club as a business. And while it may be a fun and exciting business, it’s still a business. The other category is the one that treats the club as a hobby. If that’s the case, then making money doesn’t really matter. Money can be made elsewhere, but the club is where the owner has his fun. So just as a mega-rich person wouldn’t expect to make money on his yacht or island resort mansion, neither should he expect to make money on his sports team. Well, I think it’s pretty clear that so far, Kroenke falls under the first category. If there’s a silver lining in this from an Arsenal perspective, it’s that the club still makes massive profits, and can compete at a high level while still earning a profit. And then, of course, if Financial Fair Play ever comes riding into town on a white horse, we might be dominating affairs while everyone else crumbles. (More on that topic within the next week, Lord willing.)
Usmanov
Finally, I don’t think a blog about Arsenal ownership would be complete without a mention of Usmanov, who still owns around 29% of the club. He’s listed as the world’s 35th richest man, with an estimated net worth of $17.7 billion. Whoa. The downside with Usmanov is of course that he’s basically a crook. Or at least that’s the pretty well-founded belief among people who study his background. So the question is whether we’d rather be owned by a man who runs Arsenal strictly as a business, but seems to be rather upstanding, or whether we’d rather be owned by a crook who wants to pump his personal billions into winning major titles. I’m not really sure how to answer that one, and the answer surely varies depending on whom you ask. I would simply submit to you a theory of mine, based on quite a bit of reading in this area, that very few multi-billionaires are as pure as the driven snow. You think Abramovich and Sheikh Mansour don’t have any skeletons in their closets? I can’t say for sure, but I think careful research mind find a few suspect dealings along the way. But do Chelsea and Man City fans care? I tend to think not.

Anyway, what’s interesting is that the longer Arsenal goes on with a trophy drought, and the longer we have to watch other clubs winning a nuclear arms race, the more open fans are to inviting Usmanov to the board at the very least. According to the most recent Arsenal Supporters’ Trust survey, 70% wanted to invite Usmanov to the board, whereas only 40% wanted him on the board a year ago. Taking it a step further, I would imagine that a lot of fans are starting to hope that Usmanov not only joins the board, but purchases a majority share from Kroenke. And while Kroenke seems to genuinely enjoy being an owner of multiple sports clubs, he also doesn’t seem to be the type who would reject a windfall profit in a short span of time. So we’ll have to wait and see how all that turns out.

Well that’s about all I can think of on the topic of who owns Arsenal. Darren will be along very soon with his first blog in a while. I think we’re back to full-strength at the Arsenal Offside.

Enjoy your weekend.

——————————————————————–
If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men. Romans 12:18.

Some Related Stories:

Category: Arsenal News, Arsene Wenger

« Happier Than Last Week? Yes. Satisfied? No. | Home | The New Season Begins »

Marine Directory

Hello, A very insightful post. Thanks for the info. Its great that if our default settings are giving us messy or stringy builds, this dialog can probably help.Thanks for the information.
jb

coming in late.

2 things....not all American sports are "socialist" look at both the MLB and the NBA. (people who joke about the Yankees "buying championships" aren't really that far off & it must be said, even my hometown team the Detroit Tigers didn't get good again until their owner started splashing the cash)

I'm suspicious of Kronke. I live in Colorado & my understanding is that Carmelo Anthony wanted to turn the Nuggets into a team like the Heat, having 3 top players & friends playing together. (and yes I know they didn't win the NBA championship in the end) bringing in 2 other star players to play alongside him, but Kronke didn't want to splash the cash & then of course Melo left for New York.

Very interesting blog post. Thanks.
FredJacob

Foxsoccer just keep showing that dame game from Sunday lord have mercy, i swear i will pimp slap Acer Rammon & Derek Taylor
Orion

www dot sportsbusinessdaily dot com/Journal/Issues/2011/08/15/Franchises/Arsenal-main.aspx?hl=arsenal&sc=0
An interesting read on Gazidis and Fox's contribution to the Arsenal since joining the club as CEO and Commercial Director back in 2009.
FredJacob

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily...
Peter Rice

We've had over 62 comments on this article, which tells the story of its own. From all the articles I've read on the blogs Silent Stan is never going to suddenly become very open to the press and the media. There are enough people in football and talk endlessly to press and say absolutely nothing.

What we do need to judge Silent Stan on is his actions and how he develops the club. At the moment the board needs a radical surgery and there needs to be an import some savvy football director into the board. I have really been very unimpressed by Ivan I know that he does a very good question and answer session for supporters and is media friendly but I think over the last two or three transfer season he's been shown to be flat-footed.

Some facts, over the last 10 years. Arsenal's net spending on players ranks between Stoke and West Bromwich Albion (I'm not getting at Stoke all West Bromwich Albion but for a side that has been challenging for the Premier league and the champions league this has been unacceptable) Into days Sunday Times it reports that we made 27 Million on transfers in this season i.e. will report a profit of 25 Million in the next annual report!.

Arsenal seem to be too focused on the Financial Fairplay rules, I expect that the strategy here is that we will develop into a predominant team while our competitors fall behind. I am not sure this strategy makes sense and I'm not sure that UEFA will not enforce it, or that clubs will find ways around it such as Manchester city's 500,000,000 sponsorship deal.

A strategy which stand could adopt is as follows:- Bringing in a high-profile experienced director of football. I'm thinking in terms of similar to Liverpool.- Bring in Usmanov into the board's to form a partnership with him, this has two advantages. One injects new blood into the board and secondly, there would be a common agenda.- I think unless something radically shifts that we will be part of a second-tier of clubs behind Manchester United, City, Liverpool and Chelsea i.e. we can't hope to compete with them unless we can attract and retain high profile players.- We have to change our wage strategy as we can't attract the right players.

Sorry if this is pessimistic but I think currenly we will be lucky to come 5th in the EPL, something needs to change
Fernando Redondo

Not pessimistic at all just realistic, some of these who come out slating Usmanov seem to be one and the same people as the AKB's often it seems, something radical needs to change before we are left behind, we need Usmanov's short term financial backing to get us back near the top and once our commercial deals expire in 2014 we should be able to up our profit by £30m+ a season, so in the medium/long term we can spend big but not fall foul of the ffp rules like City/Chelski might do. I just hope Stan isn't as stubborn as Wenger or we are in big trouble.
Gigi_man

I will have to come back to comment on the post . because I am serious about the subject (business in general not Arsenal as business), and because I would have to support my comments.

But my 1st commment is: nice blog, it changes from the transfers and games ones, while still entertaining.
Casimir

Well at least Rosicky has a nice pass to set up a ridiculous penalty....
Chicago Gunner

Excellent point. I could see kroenke seeing that usmanov wanted to buy a majority stake and buying it to sell usmanov at an inflated price. Wouldn't be a dumb move.
Goonerboy

Kroenke is a sports investor and appears to take a long term view of things. He as far as I can see has never relinquished a major investment. He has made a point of excluding Usmanov from the Board-especially after the latter increased his stake in the club. I don't think that Stan could care less what the fans think-and I doubt if he thinks the AST represent anyone but the AST. I'm sure that Stan would like to see the team as being more successful-but is not going to spend money himself in order to achieve that goal-however he is also not planning to take out the kind of money the Glazers do.
I think mid table is where Arsenal will be without spending big money. Our squad is no better than Aston Villas or Stokes or at best Spurs so why do we think we should be better than them? We are currently 17th-and thats not surprising.
If we want Usmanov to take over and some do-the fans of this club have to get off their arses and demand the sacking of this out of touch Board-and be prepared to boycott games in large numbers. It isn't going to happen a sizeable minority of our supporters don't care about success on the field and are far more concerned about profits than players.
Bertrand

Who does Spurs have in the class of Van Persie or Vermaelen or Sagna? Or even Wilshire?
FredJacob

Exclusive: Jack Wilshere out for three months - http://www.mirrorfootball.co.u...
ASDF

I wish I could tag Homey in this comment....not so D&G now is it? TV5's injury last year was kept under wraps like this and we never saw him during the season. I am not sure why this happens to Arsenal so many times. I agree that players get injured in international duty which is not in our hands, but why is it that we always seem to have more players and especially the important players on the treatment table?? Is our fitness and training routine at fault? Do we have a competent medical staff? Or is it plain and simple bad luck?? To Bertrand and Perry...I am not blaming anyone in management or coaching staff...just wondering out loud that's it.
formos

You are just paying too much attention to Arsenal, other
clubs also has their jinxes with injuries. Look at Chelsea they lost their key
midfielder for second year in row, ManU had their Hargreaves out for how long? 2-3
years? Juventus suffering from injuries as well and their fans think they have
bad physicians too. It’s a competitive sport, injuries are part of game and
happen to everyone.
TK

Lovely. Thank you Arsene Wenger for overplaying him. And thank you medical team for being absolute garbage in recent seasons, so much so that it left us in the situation where we needed to play an 18 year old in nearly every match all season. Thank you.
Casimir

How is this Wenger's fault? He was injured during international competition. His playing time with Arsenal has no effect on him getting injured from a rough challenge while playing for England.
TK

I distinctly remember him having an ankle injury in March, before the second leg against Barcelona if my memory serves me right. He was starting to pull up with little injuries already at that point, and then he had a bit of a back problem too I think. But you're right, perhaps they're less related than I made it seem at first, but to throw him into the first team, and play him for 50 matches, and expect nothing to happen is naive at best. At best. He didn't break anything during this rough challenge, so I think it'd be safe to say this injury, to which he keeps having setbacks under the watch of our medical staff, is due to a combination of his deteriorated physical condition and the challenge in question. The responsible thing to have done would have been to play him less often. I don't doubt we did the same thing to Fabregas' hamstrings.
Perry S.

Do you even watch the stars of other teams? Barca literally play Xavi and Iniesta every single match that they can. If a player is healthy, you play him, unless its a cup match in which you look for rotation.
FredJacob

its a good thing Wenger beg him not to go to the Euro under 21 games because things might off been worse, so the boss still deserve some praise
Anonym

There is lot of talk about runing club like business & within its means etc but.. football clubs exit to entertain & win matches ,that is raison d'etre of a football club. Yes in 24 team league there are many teams who may not win or might not have won it for long long time but going out of top 4 , or not winning for long time is not far from relegation for bigger/successfull club of Arsenal size & reputation. On the picth you expect players to put in everything for 90 minutes ( face strong , career ending takles etc) so should club do..I fully support Wenger but it seems his economics overrides his sporting abilities & unfortunately the board wants the same.Someone (his close frined or family)should tell him to forget that. In years time if wnger will be remebered then it is for his sucess on football field & not how much he earned for Arsenal.Yes, he helped build new stadium but that story/process should have ended a year back & focuss should have been on on filed success.
It is for his sake if not for Arsenal that he should try to build a wining team now or go to a new club.If existance of a club is all that is important then why not try your best now..what is the worst, Leeds! But Leeds is still there. nobody is saying Arsenal should become like Leeds but no need to show profit every year.Break even should do as long as you are servicing the debt.
Common wenger try your best, fans want to see your football Managerial capabilities in full display. They love you for football not for your economics degree as there are better players in that field if one wants to follow/worship.
It is difficult to agree that we can't afford better players than Chamakh , Arshavin or NB.
formos

Arshavin was immense then he arrived, best purchase of that year! He still has something left in him, just needs to motivate himself to play better.
Rockett

As i consistantly write i live in the USA life long Arsenal fan and ex pat if we want to win titles it will never happen with kroenke as head his sports franchises are average at best but do operate within budgets and make him and shareholders money Bracewell Smith made a mistake selling to him we should have sold to the russian who has a ton more money and really loves and cares about and is a fan of Arsenal he would have spent billions to win the champions league when are the fans going to understand that the reason wenger cant spend so much is because of Kroenke being a shrewd tight buisnessman he probably told wenger you cant spend any money untill we qualify for champions league he is no fan of Arsenal FC and i anyone should be fired it is this guy mark my words he will this is his m o spend a little money first couple years try and get lucky win championship sell players for profit WE WILL continue to slide down table and end up an average team untill this is changed get him out the Billionaire russian who loves our team and is worth 6 times as much in or suffer the consequences
formos

To be completely fair David Dein led us to situation like
this. He reached agreement with Usmanov and sold shares to him. That prompted
other shareholders reconsider their stance on club and seek balance.

Usmanov is crook. I do not want him running Arsenal Football
Club. Why anyone would want his as our sugar daddy? You should be proud that
Arsenal are self-sustaining club and probably the only one supporting true
sportsmanship values.

You are free to change loyalties and chose to support
ManCity or Chelsea if you want club to splash money around and bend rules as
they wish.

I support Wenger and club on their decision to grow club
within FFP rules and would be hugely disappointed if Usmanov would take over.
It will be so much more fun and pleasure then Arsenal wins without cheating! I
believe it is only matter of time!
Alireza Fayyazmanesh

ther is somthing we all must pay attention to, we want win trophies or only be sorviver same other clubs underneath the top 4, to lose 8-2 and 2-0 respectively United and liverpool showed us how importand is to spend money, MONEY BRING MONEY every time we win a trophy get lot of money thats why Fergie have many of trophies and we still talk about play nice football but without any cucsess, if you are satisfied with that be my guest
Homey_Mills

I'm glad to see a lot of people with comments on this matter today. I thought I'd bore everyone to death with more financial/board room talk. But it's good to hear different views on that, and learn more on the topic myself.
BnT

Youre the first blogger I have seen that has said that most billionaires have skeletons.

Remember when Usmanov first turned up our board, the ones who have NEVER put in a penny, were quick to paint him as the Mafia Raping Gansta Criminal, from......Eastern Europe!!!! no less, heaven forbid.

Look at what he invests in, he has shareholdings in high tech companies like Twitter and Facebook amoungst others.

You facts about kroenke and how he made his money dont go in depth in terms of where and how he made it. He was a nobody before he married the family then the real estate he invested in always had the benifit of having a wallmart rent from him, unlike pre marriage. Usmanov is by far the more on the ball of the two.
Alireza Fayyazmanesh

Sorry i think our fellow Bertrand and Perry doesn`t live in real world. how many years we are going without any trophies. which clubs you can find to become something with empty pocket
is it not enough that we have had failur year by year? when was last time City became one of the top 4, if you have short memory i will tell you from that moment a rich idiot comes with the end less packet of money,but you are both right this is f*ing blod money but my friends today money talks no matter we like it or not.
BnT

"If we had to make a comparison, it would maybe be as if he owned Aston Villa or Everton".

He's on track for turning us into a club of that level within the next 12 months.

"if Financial Fair Play ever comes riding into town on a white horse, we might be dominating affairs while everyone else crumbles"

Except of course Man United who have not only made millions in profits whilst going out and buying real quality to add to their Champions and CL final team, they are about to get rid of the vast majority of their debt by floating in Singapore. Added to this bad news is the fact that their commercial department come out with amazing deals like £40 for training tops, unlike ours who earn money for sitting on their arses and figuring out ways to raise more money from us without spending it on transfers "6.5% because gas and electric have gone up" (pfft).

"he also doesn’t seem to be the type who would reject a windfall profit in a short span of time".

He will be forced out by the fans in less than 24 months, the only thing we have to pray for is that Usmanov is still around when this comes to pass.

Good write up btw.
Andylowe14

Man utd aren't run on the same model as city or chelsea, you dont have to point this out to us
Homey_Mills

Yeah, it was a bit of an exaggeration on my part to say we might be dominating if FFP comes riding into town. Obviously Man Utd can still be well-positioned, even though they're not currently compliant.
Alireza Fayyazmanesh

this problem of budget is not new. it already started around 2006 when manager started to throw out all the experiences player, so i don`t think it has something with Stan Kroenke to do, of course every rich mans wish is to make big money with small investment and who is better these young tallented fellow and the Wenger and company make this happend. the problem is Arsenal lost desire of win a trophy and this is f*ing sad, that`s why we are here today 8-2
Richmoments

More Slippery Stan than Silent Stan. The board needs to show strong leadesrship and I dont see any. My view is Stan is just in it for the money. Once the stadium is paid off he has got himself a revenue stream that will run and run regardless of whether we win anything. The old board made millions by selling their shares once they improved the real estate by building the 'Grove'. New owner is no different. When did we last have someone who put money in rather than just took it out.
Usmanov appears to be a fan, so I feel his aim would be to win. The great thing about a Russian is if you bring gun to a knife fight he's going to comeback with a bigger gun. He's not going to stand there and say it's not fair.
Martin

"Usmanov appears to be a fan"

I assume you meant to say, "Usmanov appears to be a Manchester United fan"
Ash

google "Usmanov Manchester United fan" - 1st item is from The Sun
Fernando Redondo

lol do you believe everything they print in the sun?.
Ash

Oops, meant to be a reply to Homey
No

Usmanov has always supported Arsenal. He lives in Guildford for god sake. I don't see people complaining about Facebook because he is largest public shareholder?
Homey_Mills

I'm a little confused by this comment. Is there something I don't know about Usmanov? Probably so.
Martin

It's widely rumored/reported that Usmanov has a pretty extensive collection of Manchester United memorabilia/merchandise/DVDs.
Ash

google "Usmanov Manchester United fan" - 1st item is from The Sun
Orion

He has a 200m pound stake in Facebook. And that's running smoothly, isn't it?
Darren_V

North America uses a socialist ideology when it comes to their sporting leagues, Europe uses a capitalist ideology. To compare them is virtually impossible as their intentions are polar opposites.
Perry S.

So very true. Profit sharing is a foundation in basically every sport in NA now.
Casimir

rather ironic, considering the social phobia about "socialism" in all other economic enterprises, huh?
Zamil_m10

we can maybe say Usmanov is the more passionate share holder? His interviews and what he says in the newspapers make him seem like so. A real Arsenal fan just like Osama bin Laden was(/is???)...
Darren_V

It's easy to say what Usmanov says when he doesn't have to put the money where his talk is. It's a blatant way to attempt to garner good will amongst Gooners and nothing else.
Fernando Redondo

True, talk is cheap but then so is Stan!, how could Usmanov be worse?. Stan looks like he is using the club knowing that the fans will still turn up even if we struggle to win things, knowing that they wont just stop turning up to hurt him as it would hurt us, I think the previous board have sold us down the river either out of spite or stupidity. I dont think it will be long before we start seeing 'Kroenke out' banners around the Emirates.
Darren_V

What has Kroenke done that is different than what was done before he got majority?
I'm not saying Kroneke is a saint or anything, but so far everything is virtually conjecture and frustration at him.
Fernando Redondo

He hasn't done anything different your quite correct, but isn't that the problem rather than an excuse?, perhaps Wenger is to blame for not abandoning our so called principles but I think the fans are sick of finishing 4th and will be even more sick once we start finishing 5th or lower which is very likely unless we start paying better wages to attract the top players.

In someways this is unrealistic of course as neither City or Chelski have to worry about profit/loss (unless FFP change the game), but as we saw recently with Man Utd there certainly is a case for speculating to accumulate, and by 2014 we need a successful team if we're to get the best commercial deals that I'm sure Stan wants.. I suppose a lot will depend on what happens next summer and no doubt if we finish out of the top 4 this will be the next excuse as to why we can't spend.
No

Why did he buy Deins holding if he didn't intend to invest? Unlike Kroenke Usmanov hasn't made money from Sports. Its obvious his only intention to buy Arsenal is to enjoy the sport he likes. Its not a business proposition.
Darren_V

Good question. Why did Hicks and Gilette invest in Liverpool again?
And there is absolutely no evidence that Kroenke has made any money from Arsenal
Bertrand

Hicks and Gilette invested in Liverpool in an attempt to make money. Now, I don't know the details of their entire operation (i.e. whether or not they actually succeeded), but they viewed the club as a business and only as a business, which is fair enough.

On the other hand, people like Abramovich and Usmanov do not seem to be looking to sports to make money. They are about ten times richer than Hicks, and not businessmen in the traditional American sense (in that they are more unscrupulous etc.). I'm pretty sure they only want their club to win. In order to win, cash does help.
Darren_V

What evidence do you have that Usmanov wouldn't be in it to make money?
Homey_Mills

Just based on his various statements about spending more money on players, I would think.
Darren_V

It's easy to say when you have virtually no say in the dealings of the club.

"Hey, if I owned Arsenal, I would spend millions on players!"

Look how easy that was. Do you want me to own the club now? Remember, Hicks and Gillette promised a shiny new stadium to the Liverpool faithful. Where was that built again?
Bertrand

Well I don't know that for sure.

But football is one of the worst businesses or investments to be in. Most investors do not make money from it. In fact, if you look at the premier league, only like 5 clubs out of 20 do not report operating losses, which is quite an abysmal result to be honest. If Usmanov wanted to make money from his investment, he would have chosen a different industry with better prospects, less competition, and a track record of not having spiraling costs. Also, consider the fact that Usmanov is already worth 17 billion dollars. I don't think he views the club as any more than a toy.

With Kroenke its different, because he is known to be an astute investor in sports (in contrast to someone like Abramovich who sinks his own money into the club). He turns failing clubs or teams into money making machines (I guess American sport is also different in their business model compared with football). So it makes sense to assume that he is here to make money, and his actions have not indicated anything to the contrary.

In fact, I think we can draw a distinction between American owners, who are businessmen and view the clubs as businesses (examples include the Glazers, Kroenke and Randy), and Russian/Arab owners, who seem to view the club more as a toy to stroke their own ego than anything else (look to Roman, Sheikh Mansour and the guy who bought Malaga).
Perry S.

I follow the Colorado Avalanche pretty closely (formerly my Nordiques). They are going through a rebuilding phase very similar to AFC and they are getting stronger and stronger by the season. So take from that what you will, but Stan likes to win, but he is also pretty smart about how he goes about his dealings and is willing to lose a few seasons if that means long-term success. A true rebuild means you start from ground up, and thats precisely what the Avs are doing, and that seems to be a lot of what Arsenal is doing. Sprinkle in some veteran leadership (now) and have a solid core of hungry, young players.
Darren_V

And don't forget that Colorado was a super power in the NHL up until the salary cap was introduced.
It greatly affected your club as their were always signing the big names to big salaries before. You know, kinda like Chelsea.
Perry S.

Yeah, the cap completely changed the dynamics of the NHL...for the better. The Avalanche had a freewheeling GM in place (who did pull off some incredible trades, rather than straight purchases), but learned about dealing in the cap era the hard way. They, however, caught on reasonably quick...2 seasons of lull, playoffs, and now really having some great talent in the organization. Hence the reason, I'm really hoping the FFP rules will do something similar, (though I do have some doubts about how strict it will be...crossing my fingers), because well run clubs like Arsenal will fare far better than those like Chelsea.

Also, when you compare the Avalanche to Chelsea, thats basically not true. The New York Rangers (much like the Yankees) are far more of a fair comparison ;)
Darren_V

Well I disagree there as Chelsea has won some, the Rangers have not.
I would compare NYR to Tottenham though :)
Perry S.

Haa touche!
TK

On an unrelated guys, apparently van Persie said recently, after his 4 goals yesterday, that he wants to play in a free role behind the striker, which is what he was told to do yesterday...and Walcott wants to play up front, as a striker. Can we PLEASE do this already? Thanks.
Orion

I think I'd rather have the faster of the two behind the frontman, so he can tear up the defences and be provided with true balls from the better passer, who plays upfront. Who's the better passer? RvP. Who's the fastest? Theo. That way, we could have a 10-14 combo a la Henry-Bergkamp. And we know how that pair turned out.
Bertrand

so whos going to play on the right?

Benayoun? Or Arshavin?
TK

Since Sagna can't ever be expected to score, he should provide the width on the right hand side and stay on the touchline and cross when needed, while the right sided player should be a left-footed inside-out winger who should cut in, ala Robben.
brenton

I think key to any examination of his current wealth and team ownership is a look at how profitable are those teams that he owns. Most likely the Rams and the Nuggets make buckets of money. The MLS side probably breaks even or loses a bit of money. Same with the NHL team, though they've likely been quite profitable in the past. The lacrosse team is probably so small it doesn't factor into this.

It looks like the Nuggets had revenue of $115m in 2009 with an income of $4.5m. The Rams did better, with $26m in income from $206m in revenue. The Avs averaged $2-3m in income over the past few years. The Rapids probably lost a few million.
Satan

Lol hes married to the founder of Walmart's Daughter... Should have cash coming in there...
Bertrand

I don't know. I am quite proud of the fact that Arsenal hasn't sold out to 'self made men' like Abrahmovic (who has more than his fair share of skeletons in his closet, trust me), and that we are still able to maintain a decent level of attacking, attractive football without billions of dirty money being pumped into our club. That said, I agree that very few rich men are pure as white snow, though that is probably true of most of the population in general.
will

True, true, but fact is that we're not really asking the club to spend money it didn't earn, or the fortunes of a random billionaire. It's not disappointing that we haven't sold out so much as that we have money already and don't spend it. Wenger made figures of between 70 and 80 millions pounds through the sale of Nasri, Fabregas, Clichy et al., and we saw only 40 million spent- in the last weekend, no less. The money we had was made through hard work and good scouting, not oil.
Andylowe14

"But do Chelsea and Man City
fans care? I tend to think not" .. well, arsenal fans do. Anyone could win titles with an unlimited wage budget and just buy any players they want.. its not the point of football and it destroys the element of competition, thats why theyre trying to get rid of it with ffp. If you would rather see someone come in and blow millions on worldclass players and pay them massive wages, youre probably supporting the wrong club. id rather win titles than buy them
Perry S.

You and I are always on the same page. I'd rather us win our trophies from dedication, hard work, and footballing philosophy rather than simply purchasing them like the rest of them.
Pablo Escobar

But we are not winning any trophies and hardly likely to when cheapskate Stan wants us to only spend half what the top 3 pay in wages etc. Usmanov gets my vote he can't be any worse, what bemuses me slightly though is why the previous board members sold out to Stan when Usmanov offered more money?, the only reason I can think of is that they agreed long ago to sell to the mute, almost like it was out of spite to David Dein.. not happy with any of them even the deceased..
Andylowe14

its because usmanov is dodgey.. thats why they sold to kroenke. If you want a sugar daddy owner you should support city, u can celebrate 'winning' (buying) titles with them
Fernando Redondo

Oh grow up and stop reading silly made up blogs about Usmanov, I don't know why some gooners think we can take the moral high ground, we are owned by a yank just like United its just that our yank is a cheapskate. I know your not alone as I've heard others make statements about Usmanov being 'dodgy' but on the whole I think the majority of Arsenal fans want us to win trophies rather than pretending we are somehow special and do things 'the right way', show me the money ffs.

Would you really accept Arsenal spending the next 10+ years outside of the top 4 just so you could say we are different than the others?, if you would I have to question your sanity.
Perry S.

If you think the approach Arsenal is taking will put them outside of the top 4 for the next 10+ years, you obviously don't know this club very well.
Fernando Redondo

Only time will tell on that but how exactly are we going to compete when United/Chelski/City pay 150k+ a week and we wont pay over 100k?, not hard to imagine that all the best players will be going to them. Please tell me your insider knowledge that you obviously have that makes you so sure that we will be up there for the next 10 years?.
Andylowe14

"Let me make it quite clear that Alisher Usmanov is a criminal.

He was in no sense a political prisoner, but a gangster and racketeer
who rightly did six years in jail. The lawyers cunningly evoke
"Gorbachev", a name respected in the West, to make us think that
justice prevailed. That is completely untrue. Usmanov's pardon was
nothing to do with Gorbachev. It was achieved through the growing
autonomy of another thug, President Karimov, at first President of the
Uzbek Soviet Socialist Republic and from 1991 President of Uzbekistan.

Karimov ordered the "Pardon" because of his alliance with Usmanov's
mentor, Uzbek mafia boss and major international heroin overlord Gafur
Rakimov. Far from being on Gorbachev's side, Karimov was one of the
Politburo hardliners who had Gorbachev arrested in the attempted coup
that was thwarted by Yeltsin standing on the tanks outside the White
House.

Usmanov is just a criminal whose gangster connections with one of the
World's most corrupt regimes got him out of jail. He then plunged into
the "privatisation" process at a time when gangster muscle was used to
secure physical control of assets, and the alliance between the Russian
Mafia and Russian security services was being formed. Usmanov has two
key alliances. he is very close indeed to President Karimov, and
especially to his daughter Gulnara. It was Usmanov who engineered the
2005 diplomatic reversal in which the United States was kicked out of
its airbase in Uzbekistan and Gazprom took over the country's natural
gas assets. Usmanov, as chairman of Gazprom Investholdings paid a bribe
of $88 million to Gulnara Karimova to secure this."

i cant post the link because the forum doesnt allow it. search it on google and you will find things you would rather not. and actually do some research before you tell me to grow up.

you dont know what you're talking about. Why do you think i'm not alone as the one calling usmanov dodgey? why do you think the arsenal board think he's dodgey and wouldnt let him sit on the board - because they just dont like him?? or are you so arrogant that you think you know better than them?? now you need to grow up. i have grown up for the last 15 years as an arsenal fan and i know what the club stands for, and it is NOT being owned and artificially funded by some russian gangster. if you want that, go support chelsea.
Fernando Redondo

I have done my research thank you and more than you, Craig Murray has a vendetta against him and if you do a bit of research on him as well as Usmanov you will find he is not squeaky clean either, I do worry when people read one blog about someone and then form an opinion based on it.

Perhaps if you stopped telling people to 'go support' another team you would not get told to grow up. I am not really sure why what the club stands for is different depending on whether we are owned by Kroenke or Usmanov?.
Martin

It's all relative, though. Sure, we can talk about Chelsea and City and how they just buy players. But fans of clubs like Everton and Wolves and West Brom would look at the fact that we spent substantial amounts of money on Santos, Vermaelen, Mertesacker, Koscielny, Sagna, Walcott, Gervinho, Arshavin, Chamberlain, and Arteta, and would say that we're trying to buy trophies just as much as those other clubs, we just don't want to pay as much.
Andylowe14

arsenal are a big club i think spending 10 mil on a player here and there is acceptable, and to be expected. its very different to city etc.. also, buy the same argument, you could say that to all smaller clubs a bigger club is seen to be spending more money, far more than they could afford, and therefore they cant compete. yes, league 2 clubs cant compete with us, etc, for that reason. But when you build a successful club and then someone comes in and buys another club and artificially increases its ability to buy and pay players, that makes the playing field very uneven
Perry S.

The difference is we stay within our means. We're not breaking the bank, taking loans, or going outside of our means. We stay pretty financially responsible and haven't really had a hand in the inflation of transfers or wages in the EPL. We've been very very consistent throughout the years, but I see your point.
No

All companies work on credit including Arsenal. Its the biggest amount of rubbish I have heard when gooners talk about debt. Where do you think Kroenke got his money from to buy Bracewell-Smith and Kroenke?
Darren_V

If the banks called every debt in at Chelsea, the football club itself would become insolvent without outside help from their owner.
If every loan Arsenal have were to be called in right now, the club itself would be able to pay them all off without any additional help. The club would be near broke, but it could do it.
Arsenal's debt is servicable and the club breaks even.
And Kroenke didn't leverage the club against itself to buy the shares like the Glazers did for Manchester United. There is a vast difference
BnT

Roman wrote of Chelsea's debt.

We still owe more than we have in the bank but you are right about the debt being serviceable.

Kroenke may not have leveraged the club however he didnt pay $1b in cash because he is not that liquid, so regardless of how the club was bought if he goes down the shitter he would either have to sell us to raise cash or we would become the property of whoever (bank) he owed. Theres no vast difference between us and United.
No

Yeah? Good Lord. If the banks called in all the debt of ICI we will have no washing powder.

What makes you think RA is going to let his investment of £500m+ go down the toilet? I am a gooner. But I am also a business man. And anyone complaining about how a club should be making money? Look at United.
Sophie

Great blog, Homey. I would just point out that the issue of salary caps and revenue sharing in American sports is not trivial, especially in this age of wage and fee inflation thanks to owners like Sheikh Mansour. In baseball, for example, even the super rich clubs are not very far off from the lesser teams because of the luxury tax etc etc. I don't understand all the inner workings of European clubs or American sports teams, but my minimal knowledge tells me that they are drastically different business ventures.